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ShangXian
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Russian diaries 3

Posted by ShangXian - January 11th, 2025


Дорогой русский язык,


Мы давно не разговаривали! Как ты? Надеюсь, все хорошо.

В эти недели я продолжаю изучать азы русской грамматики. Я изучала родительный и винительный падежи множественного числа, но в последнее время я также изучаю глаголы движения. Надеюсь продолжать в том же духе, теперь увидимся в следующий раз.


С наилучшими пожеланиями


Твоя подруга!


Ok this was just a mere exercise with Russian writing and an excuse to practice with what I learnt and I keep learning in this period. And last time we left off with verbs of motion. Verbs of motions are one of the toughest part of Russian language along with plural genitive, that I mentioned in my fictional letter to Russian language, for those not used to such level of specificity that I personally love. In Russia you can't and don't simply "go"!


iu_1334178_20153888.webp

meme taken from: https://www.reddit.com/r/russian/comments/rk9boe/russian_verbs_of_motion/


I almost memorized all the verbs I've shown in the previous diary, conjugation is not a problem. Under this aspect Russian language has an easy way to conjugate verbs compared to Bulgarian and Serbo-Croatian, not to mention that infernal hell that is Romance language conjugation system....


But what makes them more difficult to acquire is the way of thinking. Verbs of motions force you to think differently and expand your mind, quite literally in the semantic field since you have to use te right verb of movement to move, lol. And the ones I am studying are just the unprefixed verbs of motion, because there are prefixed verbs of motion which acquire a different meaning.


I have noticed two core elements that make verbs of motions challenging (but also fascinating from an anthropological point of view):


1) different way of seeing, thinking and reasoning behind them (this might have some anthropological roots that I have yet to discover, my research in the academic abstracts and papers still struggles to find an answer)


2) the way they are taught


In the first case we discover that there a languages that specify very much aspects of life, in this case the movement. Both in English and even worse in Italian there are few verbs to show movement. English has mainly "to go" that engulfs what Russian wants to convey with ИДТИ-ХОДИТЬ, ЛЕТЕТЬ-ЛЕТАТЬ, ПЛЫТЬ-ПЛАВАТЬ etc. Italian only has "andare/venire" that convey in a very generic way these semantic nuances.


In the second case the traditional way of conceptualizing and teaching UVoMs (unprefixed verbs of motion) is based on the rather ambiguous category "directionality" (cf. Isačenko, 1960). This traditional approach is deeply rooted in the tenets of European structural linguistics, which a priori considers any grammatical category as a privative opposition. Searching for universal semantic invariants associated with specific morphemes, structuralist linguistics abstracts from contextual factors and fails to provide an easily applicable guide to choosing the correct UVoM. And when you have to teach Russian as second language (L2) this becomes a problem.


We know that the relationship between “linguistic theories” and the way second/foreign language (L2) instruc-tors conceptualize and teach linguistic patterns under the guise of “pedagogical grammar” and “teaching methodology” is a subject of ongoing discussion and questioning. I've attended an entire course last year about Italian as second language and all theories linked to L2 teaching so I feel this ongoing discussion. All influential L2 teaching paradigms (seethe the Direct Method (cf. Besse, 2010, 9-11; Marchand, 1913;1914;1927) and the Neurolinguistics Approach (cf. Germain, 2018) just to cite a few) have been inspired by advances in theoretical and applied linguistics.


On the other hand, L2 pedagogy has always been guided by the grammar-as-a-tool-not-a-goal principle. The search for simple and intuitive tools to teach and process a second language makes L2 pedagogy very cautious regarding linguistic knowledge. I totally agree with the French pedagogue Louis Marchand when he used the metaphor of lever when teaching L2, I quote his sentence:


Like a lever we use to lift a weight should not be heavier than the weight itself, the grammar used as a tool helping L2 learners to cope with difficulties of the target language, should not be more difficult for learners and teachers than the material it helps acquire.”(cited in Puren, 1998, 52).


And it's interesting how this metaphor, manifesting the grammar-as-a-tool-not-a-goal claim, echoes the problem-solving principle known as Occam's razor, which recommends searching for the simplest possible explanations. I personally think that to evaluate whether a given teaching approach is the same awkward-to-use lever referred to by Marchand in 1920 one must take into account these elements:


  • empirical research on comparative testing of teaching methods
  • epistemological analysis of the linguistic knowledge underlying L2 pedagogical grammar 
  • teaching methods


Considering that teachers tend to see teaching strategies they are familiar with as the only possible and correct way of presenting linguistic information to learners, it's quite clear that the current way to teach Russian verbs of motion is inefficient and only complicates things.


In the case of Russian verbs of motion (VoMs) and specifically unprefixed verbs of motion(UVoMs), the traditional way of teaching them is based on on the opposition between unidirectional vs. nondirectional (or multidirectional) motions. Linguistics such as Bernitskaїa, 2017-2019, Paškina, 2007 and Gepner in 2016 have criticized the traditional directionality-based conception of UVoMs, actualizing long-standing controversy surrounding the category of directionality in linguistics.


Russian language has a further layer of difficulty because apart from the four universal characteristics of motion–moving object, goal/location of motion, the path followed, and manner of motion –some (but not all) Russian verbs encoding motion are sensitive to the lexico-grammatical subcategory as part of the general category of verbal aspect.


This subcategory applies to a small group of imperfective verbs that have two distinct imperfective variations, each associated with one of two kinds of basic stems; think about ИДТИ-like and ХОДИТЬ-like stems. The issue is further complicated because the Russian language requires differentiation between motion on foot and by means of transportation (internally screaming). Even though there is no generic verb of motion in Russian, ИДТИ/ХОДИТЬ can be generalized for motion that does not take place on foot if it occurs within a locality or it is a fixed-route traffic and here, ИДТИ is used much more often in a metaphorical sense. I suggest to read works from Nesset, 2010; Raxtina, 2004; Nesset & Janda, 2022; Veličko, 2018, 611, and Nesset & Janda, 2022 to better grasp this.


All these complications lead to the fact that contextual meanings of different UVoMs are deter-mined by a complex combination of grammatical, pragmatic, and situational variables difficult to encapsulate in a one single “rule”. The concept направленностьдвижения (directionality of motion) has earned a reputation for being dominant in linguistics, but there is no universal consensus on the semantics of UVoMs like Paškina in 2007 noticed while analyzing and identifying 11 terminological pairs employed in Russian linguistics for this purpose. Paškina concluded that they are not very helpful in explaining them.


There is another problem to keep in mind: the definition of направленность. We don't have a single definition, for example  the Russian L2 pedagogical grammar Книга о грамматике defines it as spatial characteristic of motion. Some linguistics such as Forsyth, 1970 and Bernitskaїa, 2019 use the concept of пунктназначения/целенаправленность (destination), but again there is no universal consensus. Both Paškina (2007) and Bernitskaїa(2019) demon-strate that the directionality-based conception of UVoMs reduces the variety of factors influencing the natural human perception of motion to a single directionality without taking into account several others, such as space, time, and moving object's vs. observer's points of view.


Even the meaning of unidirectionality has not a clear definition but many researchers argue that unidirectional verbs encode the motion proceeding “in/from a single direction toward a goal”. As for nondirectional ХОДИТЬ-like verbs, their meaning is not easy to define either, so it's not an easy task^^'


Considering that most of what I said here is heavily based on this important study that I discovered these past days, I highly suggest you to give it a read to have a full grasp of what I said and think about the limits of the traditional approach that even my grammar book seems to use: https://dislaw.at/ds/article/view/106/104


Just know that the alternative approaches, such as Semantic Labeling (Bondarenko, 2023) seem to be able to make up for the shortcomings of the traditional approach and offer a more intuitive methodology for teaching UVoMs. They are situation based, item-focused, and experience-driven approaches and they converge with the principles of cognitive linguistics.


As last thing before closing this journal is that two Russia-born linguistics–Sergej (Serge) Karcevskij (1884-1955) and Alexandr Isačenko (1910-1978) –have credits for the concept of privative (asymmetrical) binary opposition (my Linguistics course memory is flooding here XD) which inextricably links to the idea of directionality.


I hope one day to find possible anthropological roots of why Slavic languages heavily rely on verbs of motions to describe space because I would like to talk about, in the meantime I salute you guys, see you next time!


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Comments

Spoken as a person who cares way more about Newgrounds than I should:
You are way too good for us, ShangXian!

Well, thank you very much for these kind words, really
I don't know if I am too good for you guys, I just love to share what I love, the very little I know and most of all I try to help with everything I can in order to make others feel good.

Я из России поэтому напишу этот комментарий на русском языке, я мог бы написать этот комментарий на английском языке но раз вы изучаете русский язык то я напишу этот комментарий на русском языке.
Удачи вам в изучение могучего русского языка.

That is all wayyy above my pay grade.

Some of these things were studied at Glottodidactics (the scientific discipline concerned primarily with teaching and learning foreign languages, as well as language acquisition, foreign language teacher training, and the design of teaching materials), but others were personal in-depth analysis reads done using Google Scholar search engine since I don't want to limit to what I studied at University courses.

wait i have a question - who do you support Ukraine or Russia

I ofc support Ukraine. No country has the right to invade other sovereign countries, in war everyone loses starting from civilians who are the first to succumb.

@ShangXian дуже прекрасно це чути!!

As a russian, I can confirm that our language might be a little confusing... but I think that you are doing pretty well:)

I agree and I want to add that each language has its own logic. This is why I think it's important learning new languages because your mind opens and expands its way to perceive reality.

During the first year of Modern Languages ​​I also studied the Serbo-Croatian and I can guarantee that its verbal system is much more complicated than the Russian one because asides the aspectual element of the verb, it has more tenses. For example if you take the Serbo-Croatian verb купити and take a look at its conjugation we will immediately see the huge difference with the same verb in Russian купить (which is the perfective aspect btw for those who don't know).

Serbo-Croatian future is split in two:

Future I

купит ћу (Croatian spelling)
купићу

купит ћеш
купићеш

купит ће
купиће

купит ћемо
купићемо

купит ћете
купићете

купит ће
купиће

Future II

бу̏де̄м купио
бу̏де̄ш купио
бу̏де̄ купио
бу̏де̄мо купили
бу̏де̄те купили
бу̏дӯ купили

Russian counterpart, perfective aspect, in Future (present tense of perfective verbs have future value):

куплю́
ку́пишь
ку́пит
ку́пим
ку́пите
ку́пят

If Russian past is pretty simple since it's just купи́л (masculine), купи́ла (feminine), купи́ло (neuter) and купи́ли (plural), Serbo-Croatian has three past tenses: aorist, perfect and pluperfect. It also has Conditional I and Conditional II (often replaced by the conditional I in colloquial speech, i.e. the auxiliary verb biti (to be) is routinely dropped). I know that the aorist and imperfect were not present in, or have nowadays fallen into disuse in, many dialects and therefore they are routinely replaced by the past perfect in both formal and colloquial speech. But still it shows how Serbo-Croatian has the verbal element more complex than Russian. Bulgarian is no joke too when it comes to verbs.

Cases are not better (I love them) because Serbo-Croatian has 7 cases whereas Russian has 6 cases and I find Russian cases more logic to understand.

I admit that, despite verbs of motions are a challenging topic mainly due to the way they are taught, I love this level of precision and details. Other verbs I fell in love due to the semantic nature they have are:

лежа́ть - полежа́ть
стоя́ть - постоя́ть
висе́ть - повисе́ть

and

класть - положи́ть
ста́вить - поста́вить
ве́шать - пове́сить

My mind loves this level of precision since it tends to be as precise as possible. I know it's challenging but at the same time all of this is also helping to see my mother tongue under a different light and I see how lacking it under this aspect.

Btw thank you so much for these encouraging words, it means a lot^^

How have you learned this much? Genuine Question, I've been learning Russian for 2 months, and I can barely say any coherent sentence, let alone hear people speak in it. The best tool I have is goddamn google translate.

I study it for an average of 12-13 hours a day when I don't go to University which are reduced to mere 8 hours when I attend classes. But it's not just the quantity but also the passion this language is giving me. I feel highly motivated and it gave me such nice tool to optimize the study of each grammar aspect. I will apply these tools for German language too because I see they are a nice way to see cases under a different light.

Pro tip: instead of learning each single flexional morpheme of cases, start first with questions that each case and preposition linked to said case answer. I even learn first personal pronouns and interrogative pronouns so I can link them to the verbs associated with each case.

for example:

dative case

interrogative pronoun referred to animated beings (nominative)----> кто
interrogative pronoun referred to inanimate objects (nominative)----> что́

interrogative pronoun referred to animated beings (dative)----> кому́
interrogative pronoun referred to inanimate objects (dative)----> чему́

I keep in mind these, I repeat them and write them down, then I do a lot of exercises from both grammar book and other resources some dear friends of mine gave me since they have already studied Russian.

I learn verbs that take the dative, this way I can learn which case I have to use and I add new words to my mental vocabulary.

Pro tip: when studying verbs, asides from the golden rule of studying both the imperfective and perfective aspects, group them by semantics and meaning.

Always using the dative case as example, these are verbs that take it and are grouped under the "using your mouth and voice to convey messages" umbrella:

говори́ть - сказа́ть= to speak/to talk
жела́ть - пожела́ть= to wish/ to desire
звони́ть - позвони́ть= to call (by telephone)
объясня́ть - объясни́ть= to explain/to illustrate
отвеча́ть - отве́тить= to answer/to reply
расска́зывать - рассказа́ть= to tell
сообща́ть - сообщи́ть= to communicate/to inform
сове́товать - посове́товать= to advise/to recommend

After this I go check flexional morphemes and I draw diagrams and tables with the help of colors. I have synesthesia (if I hear a sound or I read a word, my mind see it coloured) so dative case is seen in light blue and then I repeat and write down nouns. Plural dative is even easier because only strong endings (whether they are masculine, feminine or neuter) get the -ам ending while weak endings all get -ям ending, making it easier to memorize especially if you use colours.

Another way to learn it is to watch stuff in Russian, in this period I am watching many Soviet animated movies and I love the animation but also the stories and even if I don't understand most of I can still pick up the overall meaning and in the meantime I add new words to my mental library.

Remember: the very moment you forget that you are learning a language, then you are really learning it. Good luck with this journey. It's challenging, I know but if you are consistent, have fun and practice this language will reward you a lot.

Удачи во всем!